You are not logged in.


Unread posts

Dear visitor, welcome to FertilityZone . If this is your first visit here, please read the Help. It explains in detail how this page works. To use all features of this page, you should consider registering. Please use the registration form, to register here or read more information about the registration process. If you are already registered, please login here.

  • "stillhopeful" started this thread

Posts: 16

Reg: Sep 15th 2010

  • Send private message

1

Monday, November 15th 2010, 11:41am

Do intralipids lower TNF alpha levels?

Hi
I recently had the full immune testing done and results showed high TNF alpha levels as well as elevated CD 56 killer cells.

I have done two humira shots and my levels have only come down to 34 ( from 38).

Will intralipids help in lowering these levels just a little more? My results show my killer cells do react to intralipids.

Has anyone else used intralipids and / or prednisolone to reduce TNF alpha?

Thanks

ruthie

Superstar

  • "ruthie" is no longer a member of FZ

Posts: 3,607

Reg: Aug 31st 2008

Location: Cornwall

Children: 3 angels looking after us.

  • Send private message

2

Monday, November 15th 2010, 11:49am

The strict answer is maybe.
The only drug proven to lower TNF levels is Humira.
Having said that CARE now only use intralipids rather than Humira and get v good results. ILs haven't been trialled for this though.

Arguably even if they don't lower TNF they could still help. It's not the high tnf levels themselves that are thought to be the problem, but rather that when pregnant, patients with high TNF are more likely to have a flare of their NK cells, so it may be that ILs are only bringing the NK flare down rather than acting on the TNF directly.

I've had ILs as well as Humira my last 3 cycles as they are relatively cheap and safe.

To my knowledge steroids have little effect on TNF levels but again they are v effective for reducing NK cell levels.

Xxx

BraveGirl

Superstar

  • "BraveGirl" is no longer a member of FZ

Posts: 4,378

Reg: Feb 15th 2008

Location: Wakefield

Children: One on the way.

  • Send private message

3

Monday, November 15th 2010, 11:50am

hi there

I was given intralipids to combat my TNF cells and my NK cells. I did not have any retesting but I did get pregnant (20 weeks on wednesday) so I firmly believe that they work. I also had prednisolone too.

Ruthie had success on them too as did deedee and bunty.
IVF 1 :BFP: baby5 in heaven 6 weeks
IVF 5 :BFP: Immune protocol Care Sheffield
Oscar Miles arrived 15 April 2011 weighing 6lbs 14oz
My Diary

  • "stillhopeful" started this thread

Posts: 16

Reg: Sep 15th 2010

  • Send private message

4

Monday, November 15th 2010, 12:27pm

Thanks for your info. I am planning to use intralipids along with prednisolone to control the CD56 cells which in turn will reduce the TNF. The reason I want to do this is because the Humira didn't have much impact. Odd.

My theory is that if I can control the killer cells using intralipids and prednisolone then the TNF should also be controlled, does that logic sound right?

Did you guys who are pregnant get your Nk cells or TNF rechecked during your pregancies?

ruthie

Superstar

  • "ruthie" is no longer a member of FZ

Posts: 3,607

Reg: Aug 31st 2008

Location: Cornwall

Children: 3 angels looking after us.

  • Send private message

5

Monday, November 15th 2010, 12:44pm

My tnf was checked pre treatment and this time had come down very well. For me Humira has always brought it down nicely.
There's not much point rechecking it during pregnancy as you can't take Humira when pregnant.

My NK cells are checked every 4 weeks although mine are always normal, but potentially I could have extra drugs like IVIG if the ILs and steroids weren't working enough.

BraveGirl

Superstar

  • "BraveGirl" is no longer a member of FZ

Posts: 4,378

Reg: Feb 15th 2008

Location: Wakefield

Children: One on the way.

  • Send private message

6

Monday, November 15th 2010, 12:48pm

I did not get mine re-checked although had a fight with Care about this. I refused to pay for more tests when they could just give me another intralipid. They came round to my way of thinking and all (so far) has been ok.

I have also PM'd you.
IVF 1 :BFP: baby5 in heaven 6 weeks
IVF 5 :BFP: Immune protocol Care Sheffield
Oscar Miles arrived 15 April 2011 weighing 6lbs 14oz
My Diary

Posts: 2,016

Reg: Oct 7th 2005

Location: staffordshire/shropshire border

Children: my fur baby shawnee and my beautiful daughter C born Dec 2010

  • Send private message

7

Monday, November 15th 2010, 2:44pm

My TNF came down from 56 to normal and i only used intralipids and prednisolone - humira wasn't even mentioned :D
TTC for 7 years (MFI and Immune problems)
6 ICSI's so far all BFN
Cycle with Immune treatment in Nottingham - :BFP:


Ellie's PG Diary


  • "stillhopeful" started this thread

Posts: 16

Reg: Sep 15th 2010

  • Send private message

8

Sunday, November 21st 2010, 6:54pm

Thanks everyone - thats reassuring.

I am going to go ahead with another cycle even though my TNF alpha is 34 because I am hoping that I can lower it further through the use of Intralipids.

Thanks again.

Duffymoon

Megastar

Posts: 9,468

Reg: Jun 11th 2007

Children: Boy/girl twins born 2010

  • Send private message

9

Friday, November 26th 2010, 10:35am

Hi there

Just to say that I had immune testing at CARE two years ago and had high TNF (42). I had two shots of humira and was retested and it came down to 37. I expected to take another two shots as that's what I'd been told previously but instead my consultant there (George Ndukwe) said that intralipids would reduce it further. I must admit i was surprised! I had intralipids on about day 8 of stimms i think. I never got re-tested. Unfortunately that cycle didn't work and DH and I were so gutted because it's what we felt was stopping me getting pregnant.

We ended up returning to Nurture who I wouldn't say are anti immune testing but are a little bit like this smilie when you talk to them about it! :rolleyes:

I ended up just taking steroids from day 8 of stimms i think and that's all. I got pregnant and have two very healthy babies now. Just to say though that I do think a very important reason why I got pregnant this time compared to my previous 4 ivf bfns was because of having gestone (progesterone) injections. I always bled early on an ivf cycle and just don't think i absorbed the progesterone from the pessaries.

I took the Humira in January 2009 and had my egg collection at Nurture on July 1st so it shouldn't have been in my system anymore. Obviously having high TNF (and mine were very high) didn't stop me from getting pregnant and having a very easy pregnancy. My NK cells were fine and perhaps having a high numbers of these is more important to be treated. It does sound like if you're having intralipids then this is being addressed.

Best of luck for your next cycle [zx189]

xx


4 x ICSI BFN
5th time :BFP:
:boy: :girl:




Similar threads




FERTILITYZONE



MEDHURST – PROUD HOSTS OF FERTILITYZONE