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  • "AngelsMummy" started this thread

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Friday, February 13th 2009, 12:05pm

The Disgusting News on Yahoo!!

yahoo news



please read this sickening news

Quoted

Alfie Patten has just become a father aged just 13 - and he insists he will be a good dad.

Alfie's girlfriend Chantelle Steadman, 15, gave birth to Maisie Roxanne in Eastbourne Hospital, East Sussex, four days ago, reports The Sun.

The boy, who is just 4ft and looks young for his age, told the newspaper: "I thought it would be good to have a baby."

But he admitted he did not think about how he would afford it.

"I don't really get pocket money. My dad sometimes gives me £10," he said.











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Friday, February 13th 2009, 12:19pm

it does make me angry, but what can be done now?

i like what alfies dad said...
"He could have shrugged his shoulders and sat at home on his Playstation. But he has been at the hospital every day,"

.......niiiiiiiiiiiiice! :rolleyes:



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Friday, February 13th 2009, 5:07pm

just madness.
in an interview with the sun they asked 'what will you do financially?' his reply was 'what is financially?'
then goes on to say he will provide for her, how? he doesn't even have a national insurance number. i think what he means is us tax payers will provide for her!! :cross:
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Friday, February 13th 2009, 5:23pm

It's disgusting! They should take the baby away and give it to a nice family that can look after him properly and take proper care of him. Children should not be allowed to have children. It's madness!

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Friday, February 13th 2009, 6:03pm

It is absolutely Mental !!!!!!
children havin children, it's just not right.

another child for us tax payers to pay for X(

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Friday, February 13th 2009, 6:14pm

This makes me so angry - how is it that we have "postcode" lottery IVF funding with lots of ADULT COUPLES being refused funded treatment for a child they long for and yet its ok to let a 13 year old have a baby.........
absolute disgrace in my personal opinion.


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Friday, February 13th 2009, 6:43pm

Quoted

Originally posted by elmo
just madness.
in an interview with the sun they asked 'what will you do financially?' his reply was 'what is financially?'
then goes on to say he will provide for her, how? he doesn't even have a national insurance number. i think what he means is us tax payers will provide for her!! :cross:


the thing is he is 13 there are fully grown adults who have the same attitude regards how they will bring their children up :rolleyes:

it makes me shudder just looking at him with that baby :sadface:

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Friday, February 13th 2009, 6:46pm

Yep!

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Friday, February 13th 2009, 8:44pm

I think it's a bloody disgrace. It's ILLEGAL to have sex with anyone under the age of 16 so how the f&ck can the police take no further action when a 14 year old had sex with a TWELVE year old? Makes me absolutely sick to the stomach

The parents should be hauled in by social sevices, particularly her mother who allowed them to share a bed

Disgraceful



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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 7:28am

Although I agree that this situation in an ideal world is most not right and truly not legal, whats been done (another beautiful, healthy child born into the world) can not be reversed.

If the boy was a few months older at 14yrs old this would not have been picked up on and spread like wild fire accross the nation, even at 13yrs old it's not unheard of. It happened 2 maybe 3 times in the next town to me before I upped and left the country and this was never blasted accross the tabloids. Although, it still doesn't make it right.

I do believe that social services are in talks with all involved, whatever help that may be, especially due to the Disgusting state of things in their departments at the moment.

I'm not sure (I do not know) that the 'mother' of the girl/boy actually knew they were sharing a bed, I didn't come accross this information when reading the papers or watching the news???

With the support of all the parents both children can continue to school, maybe finish with good grades and have a great carrer and live happily ever after being great parents, who knows what with happen. From the interview I watched on TV both children should be encouraged to continue and finish school as they are very, very young and in obvious need of it.

All children born in the UK have national insurance numbers, they just aren't issued them until they are 15/16years old.

Every child born in the Uk is entitled to free education, healthcare and benificial support from the government if deemed so. the same as anyone who walks into the country as an immigrant or asylum seeker, so although they may receive benefits fro US tax payers (which I also pay), there are people out genuinely in need of the benefit and not just sponging. There are also grown women/men in receipt of these benefits that us tax payers are funding.

I think the OP stating they should have the baby taken off them and given to someone that will care for them is a bit OTT, I know how difficult it is when trying for a baby and having to fund IVF etc I have been there and done it, but someones own fertiltiy can not be blamed be them children or not. As for caring, look around you, look at whats been brought to a head since the baby P case, the people who were guility of these tragedies where GROWN UPS, women and men of child bearing age, people who were supposed to be care givers, with contact with social services - I think age is debatable in this case and full support and parenting skills, classes given as an extra after school.

I believe the child mother (I dont know her name?) is now back at home (with her parents) with full ongoing support, this I suppose the nation should be Thankful for as I suppose it means one less child on the at risk register or god forbid another child to mourn.

Sorry if I have ranted on, this is just the way I see things as others stated they see it.

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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 8:15am

I just have one question on this issue and it is a complicated one:

A male needs a good deal of testosterone to produce healthy sperm or any sperm at all. Testosterone would bring about development of "secondary" male characteristics including body hair and the voice breaking. So, if this child father's voice has not yet even broken, how the HELL does he have enough testosterone to produce sperm to bring about a pregnancy?

I will not pass judgement on their activities or what their parents were doing as I KNOW that no matter how well informed your child is or how much a parent tries to prevent just this type of thing happening, it DOES happen - I have friends, acquaintances, colleagues and I even recall some ladies on this forum who have fallen pregnant at 14 and 15 years old so to condemn these kids and their families would be to condemn all the others I know that similar things have happened to...


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This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "Rene" (Feb 14th 2009, 8:18am)


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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 8:35am

When puberty starts the hormones are all over the place. Maybe you can't see the sign of manhood, but there may have been enough hormones to make sperm.


Mrsantro, I still think that if social services would take the babies away from these ery young parents, kids might think twice. There is no consequence severe enough for the children in this country to make them think twice before they have unprotected sex. I work in a secondary school and I can assure you that kids don't see anything wrong with having unprotected sex and having babies at 13. Some aspire to this and that's what they want to do when they finish school. In my school at least the numbers of pregnancies are going up. There is no deterrant or social stigma attached to teenage pregnancies. On the other hand they are made to feel special and important with lots of money thown at them. I know cos they tell me.
A baby can be very well looked after and loved by people that are not its birth parents.

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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 8:50am



A beautiful healthy baby it may be, but it was a beautiful healthy baby born to two children. The child's father is a child himself. He was TWELVE when she was conceived and no matter how I look at that, it's just plain wrong.

Yes, I understand about teenage pregnancies, but there is a massive difference between a 12 year old CHILD having sex and a 15 year old having sex.



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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 9:19am

I know. God he does look like a small boy. It makes me a bit sick thinking about it. How can that girl have had sex with him? Why can't the police take action then? It is illegal, isn't it?

It's put me off my breakfast...

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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 9:29am

I agree Eeyore, looking at the picture you have posted, looks like a family shot of brother, sister and new baby sister, it is wrong which is what DH & myself were discussing this morning watching skynews. The boy doesn't even look 13yrs old to me, he simply looks around 7yrs IMO this makes it worse to look at.

Hi Maria, I appreciate that you work in a school as a teacher (I have the upmost respect for your profession) and I agree that the baby could be well looked after by other people other than her birth parents (as my husband was adopted and brought up in a wonderful environment, with loving parents full education and financially secure), but this is stating that the Real Parents are not even being given a chance here and that it would be acceptable to write anyone off under the age of 16 as incapable or just to teach them a lesson. ( I do think that sex under 16 is illegal even if both parties are under age, not sure about the poilce involvement.)

I think they will both learn a very valuable lesson when all the hype calms down and the baby becomes more and more demanding and who knows maybe they will decide that they can not provide for the little mite as first anticipated and make a choice to place the baby into the hands of someone that can do this either on a temporary or full time basis. But until this moment I don't think we can really act as Judge, Jury or executioner.

I wouldn't agree on 'taking a baby from its natural parents' (this is just my opinion) as a deterent for young people, as young people are hormonally challenged anyway and for someone who has just given birth to have a baby taken away from them could be the cause of mental health issues (PND), depression etc, which then in turn would lead to other issues involving counselling etc, another hinderence on the UK tax payers money and resulting in another broken, disfunction family which the papers are talking about.

I think its down right crazy that school children these days aspire to be wannabe porn stars, gangsters or young parents, children should be children/Teenagers for as long as possible and experience all the joys, adventures and trials that life has to offer before making a huge choice of starting a family.

I just see it as another harsh reality of a broken society and its disapointing to say least.

I'm hoping that my parenting skills result in my daughter having the intelligence to make the right choices in life and not go down this route, I'm also hoping that I never find myself in this situation as a parent but if it ever does happen I'm sure I will be there for her offering my full support and care regardless.

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "mrsantro" (Feb 14th 2009, 9:31am)


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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 10:00am

Bit of a sore subject for me as my mum was a teenage mum and I was also a teenage mum. My daughter is only 15 and as ashamed as I am to admit it, I have had to get her fitted with the contraceptive implant as she admitted to having sex with her boyfriend who she has been with for one year. It could just as easy have been her. Yes its wrong and yes she is underage but bar tieing her to my leg what can I do, she will find somewhere to do it. Its hard being the parent of a teenager and its the hardest thing I've ever had to do. As shocking as it is these things happens and thankfully my daughter had the sense to admit that she was having sex so I would never pass judgement on these cases.
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This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "Lexie" (Feb 14th 2009, 10:10am)


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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 10:22am

It's just so wrong, he looks so.... well like a child.

I don't know what's wrong with society. I think for me growing up I did silly things but the thought and well... fear of telling my parents I'd got pg, taken drugs etc and their disappointment far outweighed anything. They weren't strict but taught me respect and where the boundaries were. Their worst worry was me being a goth!!
I truly hope that my son will know what's acceptable and what's not.


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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 10:37am

I think there is a huge difference in *most* children from 12 to 15, at 15 *most* are starting to see the world through different eyes and are becomming young adults, at 13 they *should* still be children.

I completely agree with you Lexie and personally don't feel that you should be ashamed for doing the responisble thing with your 15 year old daughter. My eldest god-daughter came to me when she was 15 and we had the very same conversation as she was starting to have sex with her 17 year old boyfriend. Yes, legally it is wrong to have sex with anyone under 16 but we're in 2009 and times have changed and I would guess that the majority of 15 years olds are in that situation. Over 20 years ago when I was 15, things were different, of course they were and I didn't have a clue about sex!!!

But this is about a 12 year old boy and I personally feel that the blame has to lay at the feet of his parents. His sister also had a baby at 13 ffs, so she was either 12 or *just* 13 when she fell pregnant too???? A CHILD.

I'm all for many changes in society and largely agree with your post MrsA, I hope that they have learned a valuable lesson but with the fact that his sister also had a child at that age, I doubt very much that they have.

What happened to the last boy who had a child when he was 12? He split with the mother a few months later. It's the children of these children who suffer. :sadface:



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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 10:43am

I'm not sure about the law, but isn't that little boy only just old enough to be left on his own by HIS parents! It's awful to see children having children.

I know about teenage pregnancies - I work as a Lecturer in a deprived area with one of the highest teenage pregnancy rates in the UK. Maria is right, often having babies is all young people aspire to; it's what their parents did, and often their grandparents. And yes, being entitled to benefits validates them and makes them feel like an adult. Just like having a job does to the rest of us.

Did you see the way the little boys friend/family member behaved on the tv? Whilst a reporter was filming outside their house, live on the news, a family member came out of the house, got in the car and forwarded and reversed continuously, laughing through the window behind the reporter (who was oblivious).

They obviously see the whole thing as a laughing matter!





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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 11:47am

Irrelevant of how old the parents are, I think it's a matter for the families and probably social services. I don't think the newspapers should be invading their privacy, and that they should be plastered all over the tabloids. Someone will make an awful lot of money from this "story" and I'm pretty certain not the people who genuinely need it.
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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 11:50am

I'd also like to add that when you raise the issue of taking away babies from people you believe don't deserve them you are going down a very slippery slope in my opinion.
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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 11:50am

But the newspapers haven't invaded their privacy, the family sold their story to The Sun!


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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 12:12pm

Lexie, I don't know what you have to be ashamed of? It sounds to me as though you are being very sensible and the fact that your daughter can talk to you openly about these things is something you should be proud of!





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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 12:40pm

I admit it is shocking seeing this lad, he really only looks about 8 thats what makes it more shocking if he looked more mature we would not be so stunned.

I think as a society it is highly hypocritical that so many parent's encourage their kids to have BF's/GF's...even when its said in jest, believe me thse kids don't take it in jest, and then everyones up in arms when they have sex and baby arrives!
And they then go on to say how irresponsible THEY (the 2 youngsters) were to let this happen, the responsiblity lays with the parents on ALLOWING this to happen and conditioning their kids that BF/GF is ok, its even cute and funny, casual attitude sort of thing.

Also there is a portion of blame with society as the above tends to be the general attitude of society in this country. encouraging that sort of sexual behaviour, look at the magazines aimed at girls, and stuff thats on the TV, those high schol programmes where they all have relaitonships ect...monkey see, monkey do!

I think everyone is entitled to be shocked at seeing this but these kids are not to blame really, they need support and they need help, they do not need to be shunned and branded as disgusting ;(

whats happened has happened, they need to move forward with lots of support.

I was a teenage single mum and I found it terribly hurtfull when people used to look down on me and assume I couldnt cope, believe me with the right support they will be fine.

And remember at what age is it 'socially acceptable' to have children? because I remember my hormones being so strong, that maternal instinct and will to have a child that at 14 I really couldnt wait to start my periods so I could have one!

in Italy I believe the legal age to have sex is 14 so it would hardly be a big deal there.

In Mexico it is 12-18!, EQUADOR, CROATIA, PERU are all 14 years old for consent
In Japan 13 is the min age.

OMG get this IN SPAIN THE LEGAL AGE FOR CONSENT IS 13!



Im not saying its right whats happened, it what happens naturally between a boy and a girl when they are told its ok to do that.

I hope they will be ok.



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This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "Rainy" (Feb 14th 2009, 12:44pm)


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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 2:46pm

Lexie, you and your Mum are both outstanding parents and not only once for you but twice, well three times.

Don't feel embarressed about taking your DD1 to have the implant, this just proves that you and your daughter have a great bonding as she feels she can trust you enough to open up to you and that you are as I said a truly responsible parent.

My sister was a teenage Mum in despite of the fact that my mum had educated her in regards to sex education and visited the family planning clinic, you can't watch kids 24-7, if they are going to do it they will.

Needless to say my sister is now 27 with 3 gorgeous daughters that she had before she was 21 and has a fantastic career.
I'd say that is due to the support she received from my Mother and family and sheer determination from her part too.

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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 3:12pm

Ok I'm gonna shove my 5 pence worth in now.

My mum was 15 when she had her first child.
My sister was 15 when she had her first son.
I was 16 when I had my first child.
My 15 year old son is having sex with his girlfriend.
My husband was 13 when he started having sex. (with an 18 year old girl).

I have never claimed benefits for my kids. My boyfriend and I went on to get married and try to make a go of things and had another child together. He worked hard to put a roof over our heads and food in the fridge. I didn't initially get to fulfill my academic and career ambitions, but I have done some of the things I wanted to do, just in a different way.

Teenage parents aren't a new phenomenon. As Rainy says the age of consent is very different around the world. 'Children' have been having children for a long long time.

If I am correct, this 15 year old lass can't claim benefits for her baby until she is 16 anyway, so it'll bedown to the parents of both these kids to support the baby. No doubt that baby will be showered with love from the extended family too. Ok, so it isn't the 'ideal' situation to bring a child into, but we shouldnt automatically condemn on the basis of age alone. If you met my eldest son who is now 18 he would tell you that in his opinion I gave him a wonderful enriched upbringing, and he wouldn't have had it any other way.

I think the only reason there is the outrage surrounding this case, is that the dad looks so young. If he was a great big gangly teenage boy, like my husband was when he was 'at it with the big girls', nobody would bat an eyelid.

On the other hand, you have a woman in America, who due to apparent mental health issues, has deigned to bring into this world 14 children, whom she is incapable of caring ofr on her own, and iven her own parents have condemned her. Should she have all her kids taken away from her? I think there is more of a case for this 30 something year old woman to have her kids taken away, than a 15 year old girl who decided that instead of destroying the life she naively made, she would give it every chance and bring it into the world. It isn't a crime to be born ointo poverty, just as it isn't a crime to bring life into the world. It's acrime to destroy that life once it is in the world, and I truly don't believe that the majority of young parents do that bad a job.

Whats done is done. Life is a miracle no matter how it happens. I for one wouldn't turn the clocks back on my teenage pregnancy. I loved every minute of it. And no, I didn't have a family to support me thru it. My boyfriend and I did it on our own and made a damn good job of it too. Give these kids a chance to prove themselves eh. They might just do a great job.


Just edited to say, I wonder how many people on here, if they were brutally honest, would admit that they were actively having sex before they were 16, regardless of the fact that it is illegal, and they KNEW it was illegal. I was way less than 16 when I first had sex. Raging hormones are powerful things, and not all kids have the morals or inclination to hold off.
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This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "mrs_smiff" (Feb 14th 2009, 3:17pm)


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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 3:35pm

Good post Mrs Smiff, and I also have zero regrets for having my son at 17, i just regret my choice of father!

Also to echo mrs Smiff, I also worked fulltime during my entire pregnancy and went back to work fulltime and then part time over the years and everyone who knows my lad says he is a credit to me :smile: and that was no help from my family. (I took my son to work with me :D),

I had a friend who got pregnant at 13 and was so scared how people would react namely her family she aborted herself with a coat hanger, dont ask me how!
She went on to have another baby giving birth at 15 and then had another at 17.
She has stopped at that, she claimed benefits for a few years and since they were school age she has worked full time as a carer.

Im sure this couple are going to be recieving parenting classes to help them along.
Under no circumstances should the baby be removed unless its health/life is in danger.



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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 3:44pm

I am sure that there are many decent people who have children at 16 or who are having sex at 15

My point about this story is that this child was 12 when he had sex and she was 14. Likewise his sister was 12 when she had sex and gave birth at 13. Whilst she herself can't claim any benefits, her mother and father are both unemployed and claim for her and according to the newspaper who they sold their story to, the family get just under £600 a week in benefits or £30,000 a year.

I don't feel a woman who lives on benefits and allows her two 12 year old children to have sex and have babies at 13 is in any way a fit mother or a responsible parent.



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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 3:46pm

Quoted

Originally posted by cazzmo

I think for me growing up I did silly things but the thought and well... fear of telling my parents I'd got pg, taken drugs etc and their disappointment far outweighed anything. They weren't strict but taught me respect and where the boundaries were. Their worst worry was me being a goth!!


That was pretty much the same for me and I think, the only way that this kind of this is preventable. I was the 14 year old that secretly took myself off to the doctors for the contraceptive pill because I sure didn't want to face telling my Dad that I was pregnant and I knew I was far too young anyway, despite the burning urge I had to actually have a baby all of my own.

We know that children are going to have sex but wouldn't it be nice if they didn't have to go out and create a new source of unconditional love in the shape of a baby. Wouldn't it be nice if they wanted to finish school, get a job, earn a living to support their much wanted family? Wouldn't it be nice if they had access to good sex education and access to contraception? Wouldn't it be nice if their ideal was to have a baby but 'after' they had experienced life for themselves so that they could pass that wisdom on?

I've no doubt that many many teenage parents 'are' good parents but it's a shame it's often misguided urges, immaturity and accident that led them to become parents rather than thought, planning and choice.





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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 3:58pm

People do all sorts of things in life for all sorts of misguided reasons. Doesn't mean we should condemn them.

And as for claiming benefits, it isn't a crime! The benefit system is there in this country to prevent much worse things happening to our society. Whilst there are people out there who abuse the system, (there are also MP's who abuse financial systems put in place to assist them to do their jobs too) I think that there are times in a lot of peoples lives when they need the support of this system to help them through. We can no more criticise this girls parents for being on benefits than we can anyone else. Not everyone on benefits live like the characters in Shameless! Things happen to people in their lives which they didn't ask for and it is too much to make sweeping statements about people we don't personally know. Trust me, if you knew about my life, I would be called all the names under the sun if you were judgemental about me! I happen to be a decent person though. (I think!)

I really don't think it is fair to say that the mother of this kid 'Allowed' her child to be having sex. I'm pretty sure he didn't say of an evening, 'Right we're off upstairs now to have some nooky, please don't disturb us!' Parents don't always know what their kids are up to, it's part of growing up and part of nature. If we did have knowledge of stuff like this, there would be a hell of a lot less teenage issues for us to deal with cos we would be in control of everything! As parents, we all hope that our kids would come and tell us what they are up to, (or thinking of getting up to), but lets face it, most of the time they tell us nothing and we are kept in the dark. It doesn't make us bad parents!

Bells I totally agree with you, that it would be very nice if kids experienced life themselves before becoming parents, and gained some wisdom, but this issue will never ever be erradicated. As long as teenagers have hormones they are gonna be having sex, and well, nature does it's thing!
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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 4:06pm

I whole heartedly agree with everything you say Mrs Smiff.

I wish them luck, I really do cause its gonna be damn hard for them. As long as baby Masie is cared for and she's happy and healthy, thats all you can ask for. When you read and hear the news of poor Jade Goody and what is happening to her it sort of hits home that there's worse things can happen than a 15 year old having a baby.
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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 4:08pm

Wow! What an intricate subject!

I have decided to stay on the fence with this one as I really wouldn't like to comment on a story I haven't even read in depth.

It strikes me how the boy looks, he looks so young!

Just wish that little baby all the happiness in the world, and that his parents always have the babies interests at heart.

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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 4:12pm





I think I am justified in saying that she 'allowed' her children to have sex, they had sex in her house, while she was there because she allowed the boy to sleep over at their house, in her child's bedroom.

Knowing that her 13 year old daughter had given birth, I don't think she is responsible in allowing a 12 year old boy to sleep with and have sex with her daughter at the same age, under her roof.

That makes her a bad parent as far as I am concerned. She sat back and allowed two children to have sex, and was approving of it by allowing them to spend nights sleeping together in her own home.



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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 4:14pm

I think the benefits thing is a whole other discussion. Most of use are in receipt of some kind of benefits if we have children. Child benefit isn't means tested and tax credits are a great boost to working parents like myself. But there will always be those for whom work isn't even a consideration. The generations before them haven't worked and upon leaving compulsory education the only route they consider is a council house, benefits and babies (not necessarily in that order). There are plenty out there who are happy to live their entire lives in this way.

I think that after seeing the family of these 'children' on television, seeing that they already live in council property, knowing they are in receipt of huge sums in state benefits and that they are seemingly happy with their circumstances their grandchild has been born into, it's no wonder that many people will presume that these young parents will go on to live off the tax payers pound and to view that as their 'right' and as an acceptable choice over working hard.





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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 4:22pm

Quoted

Originally posted by Eeyore




I think I am justified in saying that she 'allowed' her children to have sex, they had sex in her house, while she was there because she allowed the boy to sleep over at their house, in her child's bedroom.

Knowing that her 13 year old daughter had given birth, I don't think she is responsible in allowing a 12 year old boy to sleep with and have sex with her daughter at the same age, under her roof.

That makes her a bad parent as far as I am concerned. She sat back and allowed two children to have sex, and was approving of it by allowing them to spend nights sleeping together in her own home.



That is true, its not as if the mother had no clue she actually condoned the relaitonship by allowing them to share a bed! and thus it resulted in a baby. Which ever mother of those two teenagers that allowed that is irresponsible actually she should be charged for allowing under age sexual activity on her premises....if there is such a charge.

Untill society changes its attitudes and approaches to sex, infact Id go so far as to say untill society installs back some morals and values (without wishing to sound like Mary whitehouse)we are always going to see this, infact it will get worse.



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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 9:19pm

This subject just makes my blood boil.The boys mother needs prosecuting for allowing her 12 year old to sleep with his girlfriend under her roof!And her daughter having a baby at 13?WTF?!!

There are far too many people in this country who think the world owes them a living!And the likes of me,you,and every other tax payer is paying for them to claim every benefit under the sun,as if its owed to them without ever thinking of,or wanting a job for that matter!This mentality is just passed from generation to generation,school(if must),babies,council house,and benefits.

Ill stop before I get thrown off for saying what I really think of lazy gits! :snigger:

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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 11:31pm

I am also sitting on the fence on this subject.

The boy does look very young and I agree with eeyore that the mother was irresponsible for allowing her 14yr old daughter to sleep in same bed as her 12yr old boyfriend.

But saying that Im sure the subject of abortion cropped up and I dont know what would have been worse?

Aborting a healthy baby because the parents were young or the young parents having the baby and giving it a life.

Im dont know what quality of life the baby will have, but like others have said there anre many adults who do a lot worse job of raising their children than many young ppl.

Its a very difficult thing to decide on and Im trying to imagine if it were my sister/brother how would I be feeling, I wouldnt want everyone judging them just on this basis but again if they sold the story they cant expect any less

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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 11:35pm

Whats done is done and prosecuting the children or their parents is not going to change anything other than disrupt this little baby's family and waste more tax payers money.

Youngest having babies has been happening since the beginning of time and im sure will continue to happen unless the human race evolves to where the teenager wont go through puberty till much older!

Im 39 and was having sex at 14 and didnt have the sort of parents i could talk to or given support by. I went to family planning at 15 and went on the pill when i was with my 1st husband. To be honest if teenagers want sex they will go anywhere to have it. I can remember many a time getting in the ex's car and driving somewhere just so we could have sex away from our homes.

I have been very open and supportive about sex and contraception with my 3 daughters yet at 17 my eldest annouced she was pregnant, she has since turned 18, so does that make me to blame?? I was ashamed to tell people she is expecting as people would think its a reflection on me and the way I have brought her up.

Everyone will have their own views on this subject. Lets just hope that little baby has a very happy and fulfilly upbringing and these 2 teenagers prove everyone wrong
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This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "btb70" (Feb 14th 2009, 11:46pm)


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Saturday, February 14th 2009, 11:42pm

i dont know what i feel about this. jealousy, anger and a bit of sadness maybe??

i know i was having sex at their ages. i also know my parents let my boyfriend stay ove(well, let or just accepted cause they had no choice, i dont know)r, but they also stated that if we had sex, i would be crucified. we had sex anyway, and if he was banned from the house, we done it at school. so i dont think nessecarily that its the parents fault cause if the kids were gonna do it,they would have done it anyway.

i just hope now that that baby is cared for properly.

?(





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Sunday, February 15th 2009, 1:05am

what could possibly be right about this situation? it's sad. It might be alright in the end but it's not what anyone would want their own children or family to go through.

That baby has two parents who haven't grown themselves. Her biggest influences will be 2 people who have not learned enough about life to be wise enough to raise a child.

There is a huge difference between 12 and 15, and not all teenagers want to have sex I didn't think about it till I was 18 at least! I still knew at their ages about the birds and the bees and knew what a contraception was because I was taught to know what it was by my parents.

bed sharing never went on in our house god forbid! we are a very close family and I talked to my mum about sex all the time when I was a teenager when it came to the time she took me to the family planning clinic because I asked her to come with me. My parents were a huge influence on me and my choices in life, worked hard and taught us important values, self respect and treat others how you want to be treated - isn't that how it ought to be?

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Sunday, February 15th 2009, 8:57am

Quoted

Originally posted by Chilli
My parents were a huge influence on me and my choices in life, worked hard and taught us important values, self respect and treat others how you want to be treated - isn't that how it ought to be?


yup! my parents taught me that sex was something really speacial and taught me to respect my self, it obviously worked as i stayed a virgin till i was 17 and the person i lost it too was my dh!!
i think the parents have a huge imput in this happening but now its too late, they need to concentrate on that lovely little baby x
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Sunday, February 15th 2009, 9:49am

Its totally shocking. I read article in Sun on Fridayy night and am still in shock. Both sets of parents should be hauled up and made to answer why on earth they let this happen! Apparently the wee boy (cos he is a wee boy) kept a school unifom at her house - what mum in their right mind would allow this? Parents shouldn't allowtheir kids the opportunity for this to happen in the first instance! These kids can't look after that baby so her mum has basically another kid to raise. I know this sounds bad... but when i first saw the picture in the paper, I thought that was his mum! She looks a hell of a lot older than him! Social services need to take action against this as totally disgusting, before theykids prpcreate again!!

Looks like the British tax payers have another mouth to feed!
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Sunday, February 15th 2009, 12:06pm

yep she has another kid to raise and she didn't do a good job with the others so why on earth is she given the opportunity to raise this child?

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Sunday, February 15th 2009, 2:39pm

The boy's father spoke to a reporter and is quoted today;

Quoted


'Alfie is too young but I have to make the most of it. I’m going to make as much money as I can'

As he spoke on Friday, his son, who looks no older than eight, was curled up in the back of his father’s car and crying audibly.

Dennis said: ‘I’m taking Alfie to London with me. I want to sell his story because I’ve heard people can get us loads of money for Alfie’s story.

'It is an attractive story, Alfie is a father and he only looks eight years old! He is really upset but I have told him I will make him a packet.’


He then went on to sell the story and arrange photographs, without the boy's mother knowing. No wonder the poor child was crying.

Maybe he'l have a lucky escape though as two other boys, aged 14 and 16 have asked for DNA tests as they were also sleeping with her, staying over at her house with her mother's consent, around that time.

The parents should be bloody ashamed of themselves




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Sunday, February 15th 2009, 3:02pm

OMG that is so shocking eeyore what mother lets boys stay over at that age let alone different ones

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Sunday, February 15th 2009, 3:12pm

Well this was the father yesterday



and this is how Alfie is having to leave the house, covered up because they've sold their story



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Sunday, February 15th 2009, 3:31pm

Quoted

Originally posted by Eeyore
The boy's father spoke to a reporter and is quoted today;

Quoted


'Alfie is too young but I have to make the most of it. I’m going to make as much money as I can'

As he spoke on Friday, his son, who looks no older than eight, was curled up in the back of his father’s car and crying audibly.

Dennis said: ‘I’m taking Alfie to London with me. I want to sell his story because I’ve heard people can get us loads of money for Alfie’s story.

'It is an attractive story, Alfie is a father and he only looks eight years old! He is really upset but I have told him I will make him a packet.’


He then went on to sell the story and arrange photographs, without the boy's mother knowing. No wonder the poor child was crying.

Maybe he'l have a lucky escape though as two other boys, aged 14 and 16 have asked for DNA tests as they were also sleeping with her, staying over at her house with her mother's consent, around that time.

The parents should be bloody ashamed of themselves




X( what absolute scrubbers! oh it makes me cringe....that poor baby.

i hope SS keep a very good eye on little maisie. im concerned for her, all they are interested in is money they will get from her story..

in the sunday times today it says that neighbours are used to hearing them having sex in the garden behind the house...disgusting.

i want to punch the parents, you would know if your daughter hasnt had an af for months wouldnt you? oh it just makes my blood boil! X(



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Sunday, February 15th 2009, 9:49pm

I read this thread this morning, and although I didn't post, it has been on my mind most of the day. A thought crossed my mind while reading but I decided not to post it as thought it would leave me open to abuse! My thought was that maybe he isn't the father after all, I've seen too many Jeremy Kyle shows where the teenage mother swears blind that the unfortunate boy she has brought on to the show is 100% the Father, then it turns out not to be as she was sleeping around!

Well, just read on MSN that 2 lads have come forward and said they may be the father so had to put my tuppence in!

Sorry to say this but she probably picked what she thought was the best of 3!

I didn't have sex till I was 16, and unfortunately my first time was an experience I would rather forget cos as soon as he got what he wanted I didn't see him for dust! Luckily I was responsible enough to have put myself on the pill. I'd seen my mom taking them before my little brother was born. My parents never spoke to me about the birds and the bees and once when I asked my Mom what a virgin was she told me it was a woman who wasn't married! So I learnt most stuff from friends.

My mom got preg with me when she was 17 but she was in a steady relationship with my Dad and they got married as soon as she found out she was preg. She always felt she missed out, while all her mates were out clubbing, she was stuck at home with a baby and PND. 30 years of marriage later and she decides to leave my Dad and go out and do the stuff she felt she missed out on, causing loads of heartache in the process. Needless to say our (rocky) relationship suffered immensely and we are now estranged.

My DF first had sex at the age of 12, he lived in the country and it happened with an older girl in a barn, when he told me I was sooo shocked and have never let him forget it either!

If anyone has watched The Inbetweeners, it just goes to show that most young lads are only after one thing and will do anything to get it! If the girl gives out, she should be prepared to use some sort of contraception cos most blokes cannot be trusted to sort it out themselves.

I am sure this isn't the last we here of this story. The only good thing I can see in this mess is that at least the child will be known to Social Services and the mother will get all the help and support she needs.

It makes me very sad that these people got so easily the one thing that we are all yearning for, but that is Sod's Law and we should try not to let it makes us all bitter after all, would you want their life?


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Sunday, February 15th 2009, 10:21pm

Hi ladies
I felt sick when I read ths story and saw them on the tv. I agree with most comments on this thread and Shelbie, as I read your post, I nodded all the way through it.

Words cannot begin to describe how wrong all of this is and yes it could very easily make us bitter and twisted, yes they have a baby BUT like Shelbie says - would anyone really want to be them?

I agree that social services being involved can only be a good thing and I hope they do their job and support the family but also investigate (with the police if neccessary) how this was allowed to happen. There is a serious case of neglect here from both families - something has to be done

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Monday, February 16th 2009, 8:53am

Whatever the rights or wrongs of this story - and there are a fair few wrongs - there is now an innocent little girl that deserves a decent upbringing and I hope that their family and the social services and other such agencies remember this. I agree with their local MP - and why on earth is Max Clifford involved? The "grandparents" should remember that it is their children that are parents now and they have a duty to protect the baby and not cash in "for a quick 'buck'" as it seems that Alfie's father has "indeed done that" if it is to be believed. What I find strangest is that the mother looks about 21 and the alleged father looks about like the baby's older brother aged 8-10 so why on earth would the parents leave them alone without making sure that - if they are gonna do it - they use protection? It just beggars belief really.

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