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chatterbox

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Reg: Nov 30th 2007

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Friday, February 20th 2009, 10:51pm

Blighted ovum & immunology testing

Quoted

Originally posted by BlondieDr Beer has found that patients who test positive for immune issues tend to fall into distinct groups and have experienced any number of the following:

Fertility and/or Reproductive Problems:

Unexplained infertility
Poor egg production from a stimulated IVF cycle (less than 6 eggs)
Three miscarriages of IVF failures before the age of 35
Two miscarriages or IVF failures after the age of 35
Miscarriage of a normal baby without a known cause
Endometriosis or any kind of pelvic inflammation
The birth of one or more children followed by miscarriage or infertility (referred to as secondary infertility)


Well I have poor egg production (4 useable eggs each time, only 2 embryos though), 3 ivf failures (2 x m/c of blighted ovum), and had pelvic inflammation and a pelvic based disease... does anyone think that I should ask for immunology issues to be taken in to account?

It might sound quite mercenary, but I don't want to embark on IVF #4 when it might be doomed to fail anyway... I've also been worrying about DQ Alpha testing and abnormal chromosones...but would immunology be the best and easiest place to start?

Is my doctor or the IVF clinic the best place to start about testing. And can it be done cheaply and quickly anywhere? Does anyone know of any link between blighted ovum and immunolgy, as chromosone issues and hormone imbalance both seem to be quite rare... ?(

Just getting a bit anxious for options to discuss as our follow up is in 1 week.

thanks. xxx

Me 40 DH 35 TTC 10yr
peritoneal mesothelioma, cystectomy 97 & 00
peritonectomy, lost both tubes & most of left ovary Aug 07


Dec 07 BFP b/ov m/c 9.6wk
July 08 BFN
Dec 08 BFP b/ov m/c 9.6wk

July 09 BFN
Nov 09 BFP 2 x sacs 1 b/o 1 no hrtbt m/c 9.2wk
May10 BFP at 8+4 m/mc @10wk scan ERPC

Found: High NK cells, DQ Alpha match, LAD neg & PAI-1 pos...

NOV 2010 - Immune IVF at CARE Manchester
:BFP: [zx076] :girl: born 25/8/11

OCT 2012 - Immune IVF at CARE Manchester
:BFP: [zx076] :boy: born 24/6/13

Fancellu

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Posts: 41

Reg: Oct 10th 2008

Location: Epsom

Children: 3 years old son

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Saturday, February 21st 2009, 11:07am

RE: Blighted ovum & immunology testing

Chatterbox,

I have had two blighted ovums and one miscarriage after the heart beat established. I did the full immune testing after my last miscarriage and found I have high TNF and borderline CD57

Your Dr can probably do the level 1 tests, I did my level 1 test with my GP, but I have to pay the level 2 tests done in US. You can get your level 2 tests in about 3-4 weeks, but they are not cheap.

Have you ever heard of Dr Toth in NY? if you have pelvis inflammatory condition, you probably will benefit from his antibiotic treatment, the inflammation/infection is sometimes the root cause of immune problems. Try to email him about your condition to see how he thinks. (just google his name then you will find his website)


Jenny

chatterbox

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Wednesday, March 4th 2009, 4:30pm

Well I'm not too sure my consultant believes too much in immunology issues...he's gone down the road of there likely being something wrong with either me or DH.

I had a follow up on Tuesday and he is concerned that after 3 cycles (1 bfn, 2 blighted ovum) we might be producing poor quality embryos, which on visual inspection divide perfectly and look great. It can be purely down to bad luck that cycle, but he wants to rule out any underlying problem.

So DH is having sperm fragmentation test to see if his DNA is ok (at a cost of somewhere between £400 - £600), and I am having all the usual recurrent m/c tests along with chromosone testing for both of us. I am also having my AMH levels tested (£75), to try and guage what my ovaries think of themselves. This means what my ovarian reserve is, what quality my eggs are likely to be, and generally if there's many of them left!

So what is TNF and CD testing... and what's considered level 1 and 2 tests??

Me 40 DH 35 TTC 10yr
peritoneal mesothelioma, cystectomy 97 & 00
peritonectomy, lost both tubes & most of left ovary Aug 07


Dec 07 BFP b/ov m/c 9.6wk
July 08 BFN
Dec 08 BFP b/ov m/c 9.6wk

July 09 BFN
Nov 09 BFP 2 x sacs 1 b/o 1 no hrtbt m/c 9.2wk
May10 BFP at 8+4 m/mc @10wk scan ERPC

Found: High NK cells, DQ Alpha match, LAD neg & PAI-1 pos...

NOV 2010 - Immune IVF at CARE Manchester
:BFP: [zx076] :girl: born 25/8/11

OCT 2012 - Immune IVF at CARE Manchester
:BFP: [zx076] :boy: born 24/6/13

Fancellu

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Posts: 41

Reg: Oct 10th 2008

Location: Epsom

Children: 3 years old son

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Wednesday, March 4th 2009, 5:23pm

Chatterbox,

CD56, CD19 are the natural killer cells, if the level of the Natural killer cells is too high, it would attack the embryos. TNF is tumor necrosis factor, if it is too high, it would also damage the blood supply to the fetus. Please read the book : Is Your Body Baby-friendly by Alan Beer, you will find a lot of information about immune problems causing miscarriage and implantation failure.

My level 1 tests are

Prothrombin gene (20210) screen
Protein S function
Protein C function
Lupus anticoagulant screening
Factor V Leiden genotype
Factor VIIIc level
Plasma activated protein C resistence
Anti Cardiolipin
Blood clotting test - APTT, DRVV ratio
also RBC, FBC MCV, MCH, MCHC

My level 2 tests are

NK Assay full panel
Th1/Th2 ratio
MTHFR
PAI-1 4g/5g gene mutation
DQ Alpha
LAD
Anti DNA/Histone
Antiphospholips Antibody
endometrial biopsy

Jenny

Posts: 2,643

Reg: Feb 28th 2007

Location: Surrey

Children: Not yet

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5

Thursday, March 5th 2009, 1:11pm

Hi CB

If it were me I would wait for your test results to come back from sperm fragmentation and recurent miscarriage tests and see what the results are before deciding on immune tests. If these come back clear and there is treatment I would be tempted to go along with what is suggested and not do the immune tests. If they are clear and show nothing wrong I would do the immune testing.

Have you got the Alan Beer book? I think you will find this helpful.

xx
TTC naturally, five miscarriages 2006-2009, Immune issues

BLONDIE'S IMMUNOLOGY DIARY

chatterbox

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Sunday, April 5th 2009, 9:34pm

My recurrent m/c results:

Anti Nuclear Antibody - Negative
Anticardiolipin Antibody IgG - Negative
Anticardiolipin Antibody IgM - Negative

So that's all good right? Anyone know the difference between the anticardiolipin tests? Is this the same as antiphospholid? As I'm sure that was written down on the blood sheet...but didn't seem to appear on results... ?(

Me 40 DH 35 TTC 10yr
peritoneal mesothelioma, cystectomy 97 & 00
peritonectomy, lost both tubes & most of left ovary Aug 07


Dec 07 BFP b/ov m/c 9.6wk
July 08 BFN
Dec 08 BFP b/ov m/c 9.6wk

July 09 BFN
Nov 09 BFP 2 x sacs 1 b/o 1 no hrtbt m/c 9.2wk
May10 BFP at 8+4 m/mc @10wk scan ERPC

Found: High NK cells, DQ Alpha match, LAD neg & PAI-1 pos...

NOV 2010 - Immune IVF at CARE Manchester
:BFP: [zx076] :girl: born 25/8/11

OCT 2012 - Immune IVF at CARE Manchester
:BFP: [zx076] :boy: born 24/6/13




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